Xochitl Ashe (01:17)

So we are here. I am so happy. I'm so happy. I have been following the Money Witch for I think about 10 years now. And it was really important to bring her to have this conversation today, given the atmosphere, the ecosystem that we are experiencing. We just had the LA fires. People have had to evacuate.

from earthquakes in Santorini, Greece. And I'm not even gonna talk about what's been happening politically, but we really are here to create an earth that is future proof, future proof earth that we can see working so well for everyone. And what a great, incredible guest that we have today. So I wanna introduce you guys to Jessie-Susannah.

Karnats, AKA Money Witch. She brings capitalism, critical, shame-free education to healers, hustlers, and creatives in order to catalyze change in their financial lives. She believes healing our finances will bring blessing to our lives, our lineages, and our communities. Jessie-Susannah is cult leader at Money Coven, an online web of

magical beings who are healing the relationship with money, showing up for their financial self-care, and becoming powerful stewards to their resources. She lives on unceded Ohlone territory in the Bay Area, California, and you can find more information of her work at moneywitch.com. And we're gonna give you all the good links so that you can connect with the Money Witch. Welcome.

The Money Witch (03:14)

Thank you so much for having me.

Xochitl Ashe (03:16)

Yeah. Before we started recording, I was sharing with you how I was listening to your book, Money Magic on audio. And I love this one part because I feel like that's the intersection between my work and your work. So I want to read this quote from the book if that's OK.

So you said, I'm not going to pretend to be able to meet you in every part of your experience and identity, but I can promise you I don't sound like a banker and I don't sound like your dad getting mad at you for not taking his advice. I sound more like a finance maven, Susie Orman took psychedelic mushrooms. Yes.

I'm so happy you're here. Would you do us the honor of just opening up the sacred space so that folks can take a moment, whether they're at home listening, just taking a pause, or if they're driving, they could just open their heart so that they can receive all the medicine that is here for them today.

The Money Witch (04:38)

I wanna start with the Kavanah, which is Hebrew for intention that our conversation today touches all the ears that it is supposed to journey to and that everyone listening and the two of us in conversation all experience Tikkun HaNafesh, which is like the healing of our souls that this.

conversation is in service of what our souls have come here to do and that it has tremendous ripple effect for healing tikkun olam, healing of the world and the collective and brings blessing that reverberates throughout the generations.

Thank you.

Xochitl Ashe (05:35)

Thank you so much. So I always like to begin with your Genesis story. Like, how did it all begin? I think that your story is quite phenomenal in that you really had such a journey into coming into this financial education and being a teacher of that with also great spirit.

And I know that you were a stripper at some point and had many jobs, also struggled a lot with money. That was part of your quest, I would say. And so can you share for those of us that haven't heard your story, how you got here?

The Money Witch (06:33)

Yeah. So we call Genesis Barashit. It means Genesis in Hebrew. So the Barashit is... Yeah, I went to liberal arts college for one year. I dropped out. I spent some years kind of like traveling around, moving around. I spent almost 10 years...

working in the sex industry mostly as a stripper. And in that experience, I got the opportunity to buy a business.

as a worker on cooperative and like former worker on cooperative, we bought a peep show in San Francisco that had already been unionized in the late 90s, which is like been one of the only successful unionization efforts in the sex industry internationally, even to this day. yeah, it's very much.

a journey of like, I just have said yes, you know, it's like when the path opens up, I just say yes and I go and I feel very much like all of my work is channeled. It doesn't really even really feel totally like in mine, you know, like I'm the vessel, right? So it's like my job to take care of the vessel and to kind of like direct the flow. But I started another business out of there. I got very interested

in working with worker-owned cooperatives about why when people have financial information and we know the right way to do things, we still don't do it that way. We still struggle to show up with money. I could tell that there is a lot of unhealed content, I guess, that was really preventing people from making money and being financially successful. And being in the worker co-op world,

Yeah, it was sad because I was like, there's all these people who are trying to create new ways of being, who are trying to create ways of being outside of capitalism, who are reclaiming old ways of being, who want to work with more cooperation and less competition. And then we're all broke. And I'm just like, this is not it. This is not it. This is not helping. I don't think that these

the ethos here is necessary. And I think, I don't think it's even coming from intentional political choice. I think it's coming from unhealed content. So I got very interested in that, that thread. And I started out doing more, well, and like you're saying, I got,

I took a couple years where I wasn't working very much. I was pregnant. I was really sick when I was pregnant. I had my son. We were living in like a collective house. know, everything was way cheaper, right? Everything was way cheaper. We were living in a collective house, doing it pretty punk. And so it didn't cost a lot of money. So it was like, I didn't have to work very much.

I was doing that for a couple of years, but then we got evicted and divorced. And I was like, okay, I have a three-year-old, I have no college degree. I have to watch them all the time. I live in San Francisco, which is one of the most expensive places to live in the country, if not the world. And I have to make this work somehow. So, you know.

If you read in the book, there's a few hustles, like bumps and hustles on the way. ultimately I ended up going back to being interested in helping people who have, I don't know, all kind of alternative ethos with their money. But, and I was for many years also doing kind of financial services for people. did taxes for a lot of like, know, witches, creatives, small businesses.

I did bookkeeping, but really the healing part of it is been the most important. And it really honestly is where my gifts are. So it's like, as I've been on a journey as a practitioner and a business person and a, you know, maturing individual in the world, I have really like decided to just step into what is the part that I'm good at and just claim that and say like,

Yeah, could do taxes, I could do these things and it's nice to have them in my pocket if I need them. But really at the core of it, I'm a teacher and a priestess and a healer and I want to just stay in that realm. And the tagline of my business has always been heal your finances because even doing your tax return can be healing. There's healing ways to do all of these things.

Yeah, that's the journey and I'm in my 11th year of business now and my three year old is 15.

Thank you.

Xochitl Ashe (12:08)

Congratulations,

congratulations. And I'm so glad that thanks to your journey, we really get to hear your voice and your wisdom. And one of the things that I've really admired about you is that you also bring in a piece which other folks that teach spirituality and money, I feel sometimes miss, which is social justice. And

Can you talk a bit about that? You definitely talk about like how to, I'm gonna let you say it, but like how do we deal with capitalism and still thrive financially?

The Money Witch (12:50)

Okay, I'm gonna answer it as a couple of different questions. So firstly, I'm gonna say, you know, I don't even call it social justice. Like when I'm thinking about bringing it in, I just am like, it's reality. Like if we're bringing in, you know, and it's like, whatever, we're both people who accept there's multiple dimensions of reality. Reality is complex as much more than we can see. But my, one of my fundamental spiritual beliefs that is underlying all of my work.

is your soul meets your body meets this moment in time space for a reason with a curriculum. It's part of your soul evolution. You're doing this thing I, you know, invoked at the beginning, Tikkun Hanafesh, you're healing your soul as part of a larger trajectory of Tikkun Al-Olam, which is like healing the world. And so,

A lot of us who can tap into other dimensions or who are very spiritual or very creative, which, you know, it's kind of the same thing. It's like we can resist our human experience. Like we are like one foot out the door, like take me back to the stars. You know what I mean? Like, I know that I like don't like, how much do I really have to do this human stuff? And I'm like, actually

Xochitl Ashe (14:08)

This

The Money Witch (14:16)

you should immerse as much as possible in the human stuff because this is the most important thing your soul could be doing right now, right? Like for infinite amount of years, it was not doing this. For infinite amount of years, it will not be doing this. But it's like you have this short, you know, like God willing, long short, but like period of time where this is what you're doing and it's on purpose. Like you need...

your human body to be walking this geography at this time. I don't believe in that idea like born at the wrong time or you know anything like that because it's like you need to do this and the more that you do it the more that you get

Like that's the most spiritual thing you could do because this is like what spirit is calling your soul into doing right now. So the more resistant to it you are, the more kind of like out of a line with the divine ask that you are. you know, I don't need to think about money in a way that is...

Strictly about tapping into a vibrational plane or anything like that, you know, and I honestly I just started Teaching a little bit in my money coven which is like, you know a much smaller circle around things about like money and vibration and those kind because I'm like this is true But It's dangerous because people just want to tap into that they don't want

to be in the very like human element of it. But the human element of it is like, here we are, we're in late stage global capitalism, we're in racial capitalism, within colonialism. This is the financial reality and finances money is one of the biggest pieces of being human. It's not like this necessary evil that we have on the side. Like this is material survival. Like you're in an animal body.

material survivals pretty much.

your main job, you know, I say you have two jobs like be you and stay alive, right? So be you is like you're living into your divine emanation, like your understanding, like why you're here, you're bringing, you know, what only you can channel to the collective and then stay alive is like figure out money and if you're here right now on purpose, so you're essential to the moment. And that means the moment's essential to you, no matter how

you know, annoying, devastating it is. it's like, get into it, you know, get excited about reality, I guess. And end just like immerse, like immerse fully in the in the humanity of it, because that is your spiritual task. So I think it's like people who teach in this bypassing way about like spirituality and money. I'm I think that they hold truths, but

I think it can be very dangerous to be only in those realms of teaching without.

connecting to all the forms of like financial reality that exists and you know, which brings up questions which I'm sure like exists in all of our lineages about like, what are people teaching and like how, you know what I mean? Like, are they thinking about the ethics? Like what are the ethics around like what people teach and give people access to? So, I don't know. I think like within capitalism, it's like there's a million

practical answers, like how do we navigate money and capitalism? But this is the spiritual answer to me to how to navigate money and capitalism to just be like really accepting, like not necessarily accepting of capitalism, but accepting of this moment of like landing on earth now. And that, and the extent to which capitalism and this version of capitalism that we've talked about plays a role.

in that experience and to not.

try to ignore it and act like it doesn't exist because we don't like it.

Xochitl Ashe (19:44)

I love that you said that, you know, I feel like a lot of us are either resisting or bypassing and

We've all had, I think January was the longest month. January 2025 has been the longest year of my life and many other people's. And...

The Money Witch (20:04)

Yeah.

Xochitl Ashe (20:13)

I wanted to bring you specifically to talk about this, you know, because a lot of things are changing and it doesn't serve us as healers, as leaders in the community, as folks that really want to live with harmony, with the earth, with animals, with plants, to be resistant to what is. I call it like what is, right? And...

The Money Witch (20:38)

Yeah.

Xochitl Ashe (20:41)

What is is that money's changing. We have crypto. I mean, there's a lot of things going on, especially if we are in the US with this administration. it brings up, I have also a lot of compassion because it brings up a lot of fear. And I know that that's on purpose as well. You know, to keep us fearing.

is to have us very easily controlled. And this is a time where we really, it's like our wake up call, like the alarms are sounding and it's like, what are we gonna be able to like hear the wake up call and show up to it in a powerful way? And I believe that one of the ways that we can show up in a powerful way right now is

understanding money and no longer resisting it and no longer demonizing it and healing our ancestral burdens with money because we need the resources more than ever if we're going to create a world that we love. So I would love your thoughts on that.

The Money Witch (22:02)

feel like, well, it's like, what are the colonial ethics of money? And like you're saying, control through fear is a big one. And I think one of the biggest ways that it shows up in this particular colonial project, the United States, is...

and it's perpetuated by the avoidance is this idea that people have money because they know something that you don't know. And, you know, they're really smart and they, you know, they did X, and Z right and you didn't and that's why you don't have it. And then you're like, I don't even want to look at it, but we have an internalization of these beliefs. And I'm like, you know,

Sure, there's some, there's things to know, right? Like financial literacy is a thing and, you know, there's certain things that people have done that maybe work or don't work, but...

It's very like Wizard of Oz, know, the way that I think capitalism is a magic spell. So I'm like the practitioners of capitalist. Yeah. The practitioners of capitalism are extremely powerful. You know, they're extremely powerful. And part of it is though, this, this magician.

Xochitl Ashe (23:25)

Ooh, yeah, talk about that, though. Talk about it like that. I want to hear it.

The Money Witch (23:43)

type behavior where they're ⁓ concealing, you know, and, and showing this very like big powerful front, right? Like, it's this big scary thing. You know, we know these things, this big scary thing. And it's like, you know, if you pop it inside of it, it's just some fucking guy, you know, like it's not, they don't really know that much. And

It's all part of, you know, it's like in order for this version of capitalism to exist and be shrouded within colonialism, like both of those pieces rely on a lot of storytelling and mythology, like cultural mythologies that have to be continued and upheld and believed in order for this to continue because on a material level,

It doesn't make any fucking sense. Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's like, this is not like what we're doing, right? Where it's like, you know, the absolute majority is suffering. And then, you know, a very few people are like extremely rich. Like that just makes it doesn't make any sense. You know, it's not it's not practically sensical.

So it has to be, but yeah, we keep all playing our little parts in how it gets like that. So it's like, the stories have to be perpetuated. And I think a lot of those stories get perpetuated through this avoidance, lack of wanting to engage with it. And therefore in some ways, a lack of like counter magic.

I think that, you know, anti-capitalist magic, liberatory magic against capitalism, collective money magic against capitalism, or just like in the face of capitalism, it doesn't even have to be against anything, right? Like these things are very powerful, but they require that we're in deep relationship with money. And in order to be in deep relationship with money,

and be intimate with money and be intimate with the parts of yourself that show up around money, you have to get in and do this journeying, you know, the intimacy work, the shadow work, all the things that are a part of intimacy because otherwise you are...

Yeah, don't, it's just like the relationship doesn't have the depth for you to really get in and do the magic. So the avoidance, yeah, the avoidance like feeds the, feeds the monsters, I guess.

Xochitl Ashe (26:48)

Yeah, I know when when talking about money and how we heal our ancestor lineages, I always say that if we have a problem with resources with money specifically, it's like we were it was it's not that the monetary system is broken so that there's like, ⁓ you know, we have to fix it. It was that.

it actually was created to be broken. It was created to educate some and keep others from that education. And so it's our job to get through the resistance and get educated. And like you said, know, like heal our shadows with it and everything that comes with it because it's

The Money Witch (27:20)

Mmm.

Mm-hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (27:45)

It's like, I know that in my lineage, as an indigenous person, we never had any conversations about money or like the most, the biggest conversation in my family and like a lot of people around me growing up in Peru was like save money. And that's it. There was never conversations about invest money by real estate, right?

And there's even an ancestral wound with Native folks around buying land because land was taken away from us. Right. So I'm really, really interested in like, what are some of the solutions? How do you get your students, your participants of your work to move through this mud, this muck of

Like we've talked about resistance, bypassing. And also just really want to be conscious to say that it's not our fault. For many of us, it's not our fault that we're not good with money because I think that some of us like blame ourselves for being bad with money, blame ourselves for being poor.

One of the things that my father, who's a medicine man, to me early on in my life, he said, poverty is the worst violence, you know, that is put on us. And I was like, wow, okay, so it's it's put on us, meaning like, yeah, we might be poor and we feel like we are so ignorant or we don't have virtue because we're poor.

but actually it's a system that's extremely violent that keeps us poor. So yeah, I'm excited. I would love to hear some of the ways that you support folks. What are some of the solutions to get us to the other side?

The Money Witch (29:57)

So in Money Coven, I have kind of like worked out a paradigm and what we do is we work on a six month, it's a spiral basically, right? So we work on the six month track and then we repeat it and every month we're in one of six portals, financial healing portals and then...

and we immerse in them, they're kind of a track. So to me, those six portals are a lot of the current paradigm of how I'm thinking about this, and they are financial self-esteem. So it's like each one we're really like journeying with, right? Like, what does this mean? What is this idea? How can I develop the idea mentally? How can I build my internal relationship, my spiritual relationship to the idea? And then...

what needs to kind of shift in my behavior to attune to this idea. And I think just like anything, is often most effective when it's laid in in this kind of like slow and continuous way, right? Like, because, especially because of the relationship between money and colonial willpower ethic, a lot of us think about getting better at money as this thing that we're just gonna like,

Do you know like it's New Year's we're gonna download the budgeting app and this year we're gonna do it and even though we've done it before and we like quote unquote failed at it we're gonna do it and the way we're gonna make it happen this time is just by trying harder, you know, and I'm like that's

Number one, that's colonial mythology. Number two, it doesn't work.

And it's not, so it's just not helpful, right? But that pattern is part of the track of what then keeps people in like, okay, and then maybe you fall off and then you're like, I failed at this. I've tried so many times and I failed at it. I'm bad with money. So two of the things that I've said in the last couple of years, I'm like, bad with money is not a personality trait. know, like it's a statement. Yeah.

Xochitl Ashe (32:18)

Yeah, I hear it

like somebody, you know, I heard it recently and like I'm bad with money. Like it's an identity that I, it's just who I am.

The Money Witch (32:25)

Exactly. And

I'm like, no, it's a statement of literacy, right? And literacy is not one thing. You don't have financial literacy or not have financial literacy, right? Like if we think about it like any other language, you know, it's like kindergartners have a level of literacy.

I have a level of literacy. Maybe someone who is a poet has a different level of literacy. Maybe someone who's a research writer has a different level of literacy or someone who's been a research, you know, there's lots of levels to it. So, and the thing about literacy is it's not inborn. You know, no one comes out of the womb knowing a language.

you know, and being able to speak it or know what words mean, it's something that you learn and you learn it gradually over time. it's like that, like literacy is always available to be expanded your whole life. So if you say, yes, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna be present with this. I don't even think it needs to like, I'm gonna work on this, right? I'm gonna be present with this.

then I'm gonna say yes to making space for this in my life, then it will expand and there's no way that it won't. just bringing that presence in and saying like, the other thing I've been saying is like, your finances don't need more willpower, they need more love. And then it's like presence, so that we're in a process, we're in like this love journey with our finances.

It's financial self-esteem, which is like, you know, how do I feel about myself in relationship with money? Do I even believe in my capacity to learn? You know, do I think that these things about my financial behavior are just inherent to who I am? They're part of my personality, my identity, they're not changeable. Am I willing to change them? You know, how attached am I to these signifiers?

And then financial intimacy, which is what I'm saying, like showing up, being present, bringing your numbers closer, bringing your money closer. And then just like any kind of intimacy journey, you are navigating the stuff that comes up. Like when you...

are intimate, you you have a new partnership or you have an old partnership or whatever, right? Like stuff comes up, your stuff comes up and the same thing with money. Like you're gonna get close to it, your stuff's gonna come up, you have to deal with your stuff. You don't have to, right? But for me and my paradigm of like understanding human life, I'm like, this is the job. This is the job of being human and I'm gonna assume that my soul needs all, needs it, needs all of it. So.

I'm like, let me show up and try to, yeah, to heal what I can heal. Okay, then financial literacy, right? So it's like, we're kind of like, I have to believe that I can do it. I have to be unattached to my like, you know, bad with money personality. I need to be willing to get close and see what comes up when I get close. Then I'm ready to learn. You know what I mean? Then I'm ready to expand my learning.

Then we go into financial maturity, which is inner child work related to money. And then financial authority, which is somewhat about some of these ideas that we've been talking about, like who gets to be the authority on money and why do we not consider ourselves to be a trustworthy source of authority around money.

And then financial abundance at the end and financial, the definition of abundance that I work with is there is enough, I am enough and I am as deserving as anyone else. So just kind of like attuning to that. And then we kind of get into some of the vibrational work, I think with the abundance work. But I feel like that journey through those six ideas,

is that's my that's my prescription right now.

Xochitl Ashe (37:11)

love it. As I was thinking about the journey, what would you say to someone? Because what I've heard and it didn't feel good when I heard it and I was like, I don't know about that. Like that's not how it is for me. Some people try to teach this journey with encouraging people like your worth equals your net

The Money Witch (37:39)

Hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (37:40)

I don't know if you've heard that right

The Money Witch (37:41)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (37:44)

and I something just never felt right about that because it's like you know what like I am a child of the earth Right. I'm a child of the universe. I'm a child of God and like my worth is infinite and there is no Level of my worth whether I recognize it or not So to tell somebody I feel like there's some

aspect of it that I like because then if we recognize that we are priceless, right, that there's no level to our worth, but it's like we already we already are enough, then it's like, okay, that could equal our net worth because if we're infinite, our net worth could be infinite. But I feel like it lacks one more step, right? When we when we talk about it without talking about well,

First we have to understand that we are infinite beings with infinite potential and infinite gifts. But if we miss that point and we just go to your worth equals your net worth, then I feel like we can do it to service to folks.

The Money Witch (38:58)

feel like, yeah, I've always sort of felt like that idea of like, yeah, charge your worth or whatever, like it's a little nonsensical kind of like what you're saying. I'm just sort of like, my work isn't worth anything. Do you know what I Like it's worth, like I exist, I'm worthy for existing, I deserve the things I need to exist and thrive as a organism.

And I also offer things at

You know, that's it's just like there's no way to say like, you know, I had a moment where I was I have a particular coaching package and I was like, I had just I had started out. I've been doing it for maybe nine months or something. And I was like, I'm going to double the price of it. Like, I'm just going to double it. And I'm like.

It's not about, I don't know. just was like this, because financially that's what I need. So I'm like, that's a more practical way to look at it. Like how much money do you need and how much money do you want? And you know, what are you trying to do? How much can you work? What do you have to offer? Literally, if you divided how much money you need by how many hours you have to work, that's how much you have to charge for your work. Like it doesn't matter what you think about, you know, like your

self-esteem or anything. So yeah, that idea and just, I don't know. I think, like you're saying, there's a way in which it can be an interesting and provocative idea because I think sitting with that idea can surface some healing that needs to be done, right? So it's like, if you sit with that idea,

And what surface is for you is information that you have some core wounding around self-worth and self-value, that you don't feel comfortable asking for money, that you don't think anyone's gonna pay it, that you don't feel worth it, right? Like quote unquote, worth it. Then that's the information. Great, okay, now you have that information. Go in and do that work. And I think...

I think on some level, maybe that's what those people are trying to say, right? Like this is connected to a core wound around like self-worth, but it's not. And something that I've really been grappling with this year, honestly, because like you said in the intro, you're like, you struggled with money and I'm like, I still struggle with money. And I feel embarrassed and ashamed because I'm like, how can I be?

You know, like I'm a money priestess, right? Like I have taught thousands of people how to be in different relationship with money. And where's the money? You know what I like? I'm not rich. You know, there was this moment. I think people are like, well, if you were if this was true, you would be rich. Right.

And I'm like, actually, that's not what me and money are doing. Just like I am traveling deeply with the spirit of money. That's what priestessing means to me. I'm facilitating relationship between money and members of the collective. That does not necessarily mean being rich. I hope it does one day, surely, but.

That's not the only thing that money needs from us or that like the relationship with money is around, right? Like this is a entry point to profound healing about being human. And...

you know, it's not just this linear thing of like, you learn X, Y, and Z and then you get rich, you know, like, you do your self worth work and then you're just like charging like a boss and you know, that's like, just, it's a superficial concept of like, what does it even mean to be human, I think.

Xochitl Ashe (43:49)

I think for me, every time it's like, you know, I had a goal like five years ago to make six figures. And I felt like for the first time I had to be really specific about that in order to break through some old patterns, old ancestral burdens, you know, because nobody in my family had made that money from having a business before. And so

The Money Witch (44:16)

Mm-hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (44:18)

I finally made it through to the six figures. And it's so interesting because what I learned when that happened was that it's always a constant evolution and expansion. And if, you know, I'm sure there's a lot of entrepreneurs here that are listening.

Business is a journey that goes up, up, up, up, up, up, and down, down, down, down. And sometimes it's like, you know, it goes up, it goes down. But if you stand back, if you are blessed to have chosen something that is working, you know, you'll see that in the bigger picture, even though you had those dips, you were still going up. If the uphill wasn't...

financial, was like lessons and knowledge and wisdom, right? But for me, the money journey is always a constant expansion. Like who I am when I make six figures and the challenges that now come with six figures were very different from when I was struggling from, like I'm happy, like the way that I say it is like,

The Money Witch (45:14)

huh. ⁓ huh.

Xochitl Ashe (45:41)

I like these are problems worthy of me right now, right? I rather have those problems than the problems of like that financial struggle. But I think it's to be conscious about that, the money, like, I like how you said, you know, maybe not the money work, but the money presence, like being present to our money, that journey never ends because

The Money Witch (45:44)

Mm, mhm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (46:09)

And I'm going to bring back what you said also, because it really touched me. You know, it's like we're here for two things, one to be ourselves and two to figure out our material needs. Right. And I love the simplicity of that and the beauty of that, because it's like, yeah, the way that I teach it is we're spiritual beings and we're also earthy, earthy beings. Like we still have a body.

The Money Witch (46:21)

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Xochitl Ashe (46:39)

that we need

to take care of and that body needs to eat and that body needs shelter. you know, my ancestors would grow potatoes and they could trade potatoes for other fruits and vegetables and maybe some corn, but I can't pay my landlord with potatoes anymore. Right. And so to really just have that consciousness that is so needed right now of

Like how are we not just as individuals but as a community going to take care of ourselves and each other when we are in the midst of major transit, earthly transition?

I just wanted to say thank you so much for the wisdom that you brought. I love so much of what you have to say and I think that your teachings are so needed at this time. And so just want you as final last words, if you could just close your eyes and just check in.

If you could share something that you learned, that you received, that really shifted your relationship with money in a profound way, that if you share it here with us, that you know is going to impact in such a positive way. I would love to hear that, that treasure that you can gift us with.

The Money Witch (48:16)

I think releasing guilt and shame about having money, releasing the idea that if you have money, you're part of the problem, that you're perpetuating violence by having money, by being resourced.

because the levels at which we're thinking about having that is not the levels of wealth that are causing violence. And we deserve to be resourced. we're people who want to extend resource out to community and...

in order to do that, have to let go of that internalized belief that by having money you're part of the problem.

Xochitl Ashe (49:15)

That's powerful. Thank you so much. I'm so in appreciation of your presence here and please, please, please go find the Money Witch. We're gonna put all their links on our summary of this conversation so you can check her out at the real money witch on Instagram. Also you can go to her website.

Money Coven, on Teachable, and what is your website? MoneyWitch.com, beautiful. Thank you.

The Money Witch (49:53)

MoneyWitch.com Thank you.

Xochitl Ashe (50:00)

So many blessings.